The summary discusses a debate between Phil and JB about nonduality and its relationship to Christianity. JB argues that Phil's description of nonduality as presented is an oversimplification that does not fully represent Eastern religious traditions. JB recommends several authors to provide more nuanced perspectives on how nonduality relates to Christianity. JB also argues that aspects of Eastern nondualism can illuminate Christian experience and suggests considering a framework of "polydoxy" rather than just orthodoxy vs heresy.

1. quote:
Originally posted by Phil:
OK, that sets out the matter we are considering fairly clearly, and if
you've read people like Wilber or listened to his teachings, you'll
find the above description and practice to be congruent with what
he's saying. This is all in keeping, too, with advaitan mystical
approaches such as we find in Hinduism, with Buddhism's
"enlightenment," and so forth.
To my understanding, there's just nothing in these descriptors or
methods that has corollaries in Christian spirituality. <<<<<<<
JB responds:
What you set forth in the opening post probably does well represent a very
vulgar (common) pop-nonduality as has been articulated mostly by
western misappropriators of those great traditions and perhaps some
fundamentalistic schools within those traditions, so one best look beyond
such caricatures to more scholarly engagements for the many corollaries
that do indeed present between Christianity & nondualisms of those
great eastern traditions!
We must be careful, then, in suggesting that the version of nonduality
presented in the opening post is in keeping, too, with advaitan mystical
approaches such as we find in Hinduism, with Buddhism's "enlightenment" . It
may be congruent with some practitioners within those traditions but it
doesn't even remotely approach being exhaustive of those traditions.
Efforts, here, to dispossess folks of such facile notions are worthwhile but a
redirect would also be helpful. Hence, I recommend the following authors:
robert cummings neville, amos yong, harold oliver, john thatamanil,
francis clooney, david loy, joseph bracken, james miller, john berthrong,
steve odin, warren frisina, livia kohn ...
Even Wilber self-describes as a panentheist, so his views, which are highly
nuanced and idiosyncratic, cannot be easily shoe-horned into others'
paradigms.
See John Thatamanil's The Immanent Divine and the Human Predicament
and/or listen to this very accessible podcast: Religious Pluralism,
Nondualism, and Polydoxy with John Thatamanil
My own notes and essays also more highly nuance many of the relevant
categories and concepts regarding Christianity and nonduality at
johnboy's current notes and johnboy's archives.
quote:
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2. Originally posted by Phil: But one thing is clear, and that is that any
experience that we can come to access through a training of our
minds is a natural one.
JB responds:
Well, with the caveat that not all of us employ the super/natural distinction
(but this is beyond the scope of the current consideration but not
unrelated).
quote:
Originally posted by Phil: As noted on this thread, I believe nondual
mysticism gives evidence of the nonreflecting aspect of the human
experience: attention prior to reflection on the data of attention. It is
what Lonergan calls the first movement or level of consciousness:
Being Attentive. And if one can camp out there while shutting down
or silencing reflectivity, then one does experience an immediacy of
presence of other existents, along with a profound sense of wonder.
One is awake to the witnessing aspect of Self, or human
consciousness -- that each of us is always "here/now," present to
what goes on in the mind and body and the world around us.
A question remains concerning the relationship between this nonreflecting, witnessing aspect of human consciousness and God, and I
have addressed this many times on many threads and in my book,
God, Self and Ego, but will do so again on this thread in the days
ahead. Your reflections on all this are welcomed as well, of course.
JB responds:
This sounds partly informative but not nearly exhaustive of what is entailed
by nonduality.
There is much in Eastern nondualism that is deeply resonating with and
profoundly illuminating of many aspects of our Christian experience is my
view.
rather than engage other traditions only through the prism of orthodoxyheterodoxy, we might also consider a new hermeneutical category polydoxy
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3. God as Ground, Contingency and Relation: Trinity, Polydoxy and
Religious Diversity by John J. Thatamanil
http://depts.drew.edu/tsfac/colloquium/2010/TTCChapter%2013%20-%
20Thatamanil.pdf
This theo-ontological polydoxy is mirrored, I believe, in a theological
anthropological polydoxy, specifically in an epistemological polydoxy as I
hope to better articulate in my own axiological epistemology as informed
by a theology of disability, which celebrates our plurality of valuerealizations (methodologies).
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