The Entrepreneurs Radio Show 025 Jermaine Griggs

THE ENTREPRENEUR’S RADIO SHOW
Conversations with Self-made Millionaires and High-level Entrepreneurs that Grow Your Business
Copyright © 2012, 2013 The Entrepreneur‟s Radio Show Page 1 of 27
EPISODE #25: JERMAINE GRIGGS
Jermaine Griggs
Travis: Hey, it‟s Travis Lane Jenkins.
Sandra: And this is Sandra Champlain and we‟d like to welcome you to Diamonds in Your Own
Backyard. Hello my friend.
Travis: Hi Sandra.
Sandra: What do we have going on today my dear?
Travis: Well, I could go multiple directions with that I was going to ask you, I know you are getting
ready to go out the town to one of these races. What race are you going to now?
Sandra: I am heading off to Daytona International Speed Way, Daytona Florida preparing test sessions
that we‟ll be cooking for the race teams that will be participating in a 24 hour race at the end of January
so there‟s a lot of a detail to get that organized. For us entrepreneurs, there‟s always more things to do
than I think than hours on a day.
Travis: Right, right. Well, I know that I am going to have to forge onward without you.
Sandra: Yeah, yeah.
Travis: So definitely we are going to miss you while you are gone. But we‟ve got to keep the bringing
of incredible guests on the show and helping our entrepreneur friends take it to the next level, right?
Sandra: That is correct.
Travis: Yeah. Listen today we are talking about creating an incredible experience for your prospects
and clients so prospects meaning potential clients and client and then use it a system that runs the
entire experience on auto pilot.
Sandra: That sounds great.
Travis: It may sound like I am talking about. What dear?
Sandra: I said that sounds great.

Travis: Yes. It may sound like I am talking about having a computer answering your phone and talk to
your customer but that‟s not what I am referring to. Does that makes sense Sandra?
Sandra: Yes.
Travis: Okay. This is one of the most important aspects in taking your business to the next level. You
can work on your business rather than in your business. That‟s one of the most common problems with
business owner is they‟re stuck in the mode of working in their business.
Sandra: Right.
Travis: Before I introduce you to our guest today, I have a favour to ask you. If you enjoyed the free
podcast that we have created for you then go to iTunes and post the comment and rate the show. It‟s a
little confusing when you go to iTunes and you click on and you type in „Diamonds in Your Own
Backyard,‟ you put on podcast Diamonds in Your Own Backyard. There‟s a little tab over there that‟s
see the details, ratings that are related. Click on the ratings and reviews and you can leave a review
there. That will let us know that what we are doing matters to you. This would be a big help for us
reaching as many entrepreneurs as possible and helping them get started or helping existing business
owners take it to the next level just like we are helping you. If you‟ll take that comment that you write
and you post in iTunes and then go over to Facebook and paste it in Fan review section we‟d really
appreciate it, right Sandra?
Sandra: Absolutely, it makes a huge difference for our community.
Travis: Yeah and then we‟ll do two things for you as a way of saying thank you. We‟ll give you 20
chances to win the Galaxy Tablet, the giveaway we are having, and then I will personally thank you on
the show for taking the time to leave a comment. In fact, let me quickly say thank you to Timmy Brown
for saying “Awesome”. I am not going to read the whole comment because they will take it too much
time. Then Ethan Joy for saying “Excellent”. It‟s just the title of the comment they left. Lee Armstrong,
“Outstanding”. Windy Fields, “Great”. Kevin Johnson, “Super”. Emily Tan, “Favourite”. That‟s just on
iTunes over at (let me get tons of windows open). I‟ve got Renilda, Zsuzsa and Sean over on
Facebook and left a review. We really appreciate for taking the time for doing that. As a reminder,
each and every show our objective is to give you a seat right next to us as if it‟s just the four of us at the
table talking, me, Sandra, our guest and you. So that you are part of a conversation with some of the
most brightest entrepreneurs and thought leaders in the world. People that have found success and
want to help you. Each and every person that we talked to has found success doing what they teach.
That‟s been one of my frustrations, and Sandra me and you have talked about this. There are so many
people over the last few years that are teaching things that they haven‟t done to create their own
success which is really frustrating or they are giving critically important advice to you about your
business and they are not qualified to give you the advice, right?

Sandra: Right.
Travis: So it‟s taking us years and lots of money to get access to at this level and now you are right
here with us. Do you mind if I segue into tell them everybody our guest?
Sandra: I can‟t wait, he is an extraordinary man. Jump right in.
Travis: As with most of our guests, Jermaine Griggs is a Rock star on many levels. He is a minister, a
musician, entrepreneur and a public speaker. Jermaine won the Marketer of the Year in 2011 with
Infusionsoft. I think it‟s in Infusioncon and he can clarify it with us. He produces some of the most
brilliant and comprehensive campaigns that react to each individual‟s behaviour so that he has a deep
and lasting and meaningful relationship with thousands of people and the majority of it is on autopilot.
Now this again is one of the key ways to having a successful work life or work slash life balance that
allows you to work on your business rather than in your business. So without further ado, welcome
Jermaine.
Jermaine: Thank you.
Sandra: Hello Jermaine.
Jermaine: Thank you Travis and Sandra, pleasure to be here.
Travis: How are you?
Jermaine: I am great, I am great. I am pumped up about this interview, quite a different interview you
said we are just going to impromptu and I look forward to the questions and helping your audience and
be with the person at the table as you would say.
Sandra: Perfect.
Travis: One of the things, you and I talked about this a little bit Jermaine and of course Sandra and I
have gone deeper on this. We feel like really the best shows is when we are all in the edge of the seat,
it is not scripted. Now there is a path that I want to take you down. But we are interested in connecting
with you the person and then understanding what your turning point was in your business that made
you successful. I don‟t know if you are familiar with the story of acres and acres of diamonds but that‟s
where the name of the show is from with diamonds in your in backyard. Are you familiar with that?
Jermaine: Oh, absolutely, absolutely. The guy he searched and searched and searched finally gave
up, sold his land and the next day came saw that shiny little piece in the I guess the gravel and found
out he had acres and acres of diamonds.
Travis: Right.

Jermaine: So it says a lot about what we already have access to.
Sandra: Exactly.
Jermaine: We are challenged that we are blessed with and we overlooked.
Travis: Yeah. A lot of times the things that we think are the final straw that is going to break us or that
we‟ve lost everything, actually is our diamonds. Once we get little clarity on it and look deeper we really
realized that we‟ve been going in a wrong direction or I‟ll speak for myself personally. What I would like
for you to do, whatever way works for you is I know a little about your back story. I know that you were
not this extremely successful marketer. How did you get to where you at? What was your story? What
was your diamond?
Jermaine: Absolutely, absolutely. Before I talk about my story if you will, I really like the format of this,
you can pick the better person because my background is playing piano by ear. And we tell our own
audience that the way to really connect with your audience, in your music is to just feel it, to know the
rules, forget the rules and to just feel the music. So I think that there is parallel here between what I
have been doing for my whole life and what you guys are doing. Just feel this interview through and I
have a plan but not really be able to improvise and I actually love it, I love what you guys are doing.
Sandra: Great.
Jermaine: My diamonds in fact literally diamonds, everything that was introduced to me as a child, a
gift that I naturally had that my parents brought out of me are the things that I am doing today quite
frankly. I remembered my grandma won this upright piano off the Price is Right in the 70‟s, way before I
was born.
Sandra: Wow.
Jermaine: Yes and the Bob Barker and people know the episode because she was hysterical.
Anybody that knows my grandma knows she is dramatic. And this piano was sitting on our living room
and she would play on it, she had this Ray Charles, Phil Men Gospel Church and I would beat on the
pots and pans to accompany her as a drummer. My beat like holes at the sofa so started picking out
the songs on the piano. Like Disney songs started with Little Mermaid, “Under the Sea”. Then all
awhile my Grandma would always have me speaking from the bible. So she would pick a scripture and
I would just have to quote it and she would say “Stop son.” she would Say it with authority. She would
say “Say it like you mean it”. She would say “Stand up with a good posture.” And so she was
preparing me to be a public speaker, I was like 5 years old.
Travis: Oh.

Sandra: Wow.
Jermaine: Meanwhile, I was playing the piano it‟s 7 or 8, picking up little melodies and things like that.
Now I am teaching my community. My Grandpa is a Pastor. I got this inclination to be a Youth Minister
and help other ministry and now I am speaking in front of adults and I am not afraid. All these things
were just moulding me for what I am doing today quite frankly. I remembered answering the ad in the
paper that said, “Make money at home”. My Ma would probably tell you more but I was just this kid that
although we are in the inner city of Long Beach and we are living in two bedrooms what they call The
Projects. Very low income area and sometimes gloomy and doomy but I didn‟t even know it until I got
older if that‟s what you called it and that‟s where we live because that was just reality. I looked for this
ad on this number and there was and it was an AVON ad and this lady knocked on the door and she
said, “I want to speak to your mom”. And I said, “No, I called the number”. I looked up at her and I
remembered she said, “You called the number?” And I said, “Yes, I called the number, I looking to
make money”. So to make the story short I signed up, mom signed up under me, my grandma signed
under her and I had a business selling a product at 12 years old and that‟s what I got myself the
experience. So I put all this together 17 last this year I played business around my past and I said,
“Hey, I tried everything else. Why not try this teaching piano commanding myself to music and that‟s I
am here and play and launched 17 years old and with 70 bucks on my name and just this dream to
teach the world what I have taught and enjoyed myself. So here we are 14 years after that still going
strong.
Sandra: What a gift. And music is so healing, inspiring.
Jermaine: Yes.
Sandra: And even today I have a lot to do and the first thing I thought is let‟s put on some music that
will get me going, so great.
Jermaine: Oh absolutely, absolutely.
Travis: Yeah, that‟s incredible. One of the things you and I were talking about is there‟s so many
entrepreneurs that are involved with music or really art in some way shape or form. It doesn‟t have to
be just music and I have been kind of fascinated by that connection. I think some of them it is that I
think were right brainers are tend to be more comfortable with the unknown. I believe that a critical part
of success is being able to venture into the unknown on a regular basis. Do you agree with that?
Jermaine: Oh absolutely, absolutely. The right brain is so important and I think that is one of the bigger
problems with education and the school system I mean California specifically, when budget needs to be
cut they take out Music as if it‟s elective, cherry on top we don‟t really need it.

Travis: Right.
Jermaine: When I think that tapping into that right brain and that creativity and that innovation and that
inspiration is something that we need just as much as logical thinking of an analytical brain. So I was
just blessed to be with having a piece of both worlds but yes I absolutely think that if I had to take the
one of them I would take the right.
Travis: Yeah. The creative part, you learned to be creative with music and then you learned like for me
I learned how to learn and as soon as I realized that I can learn because I grew up in the hood, in a
very, very tough environment. At 21 the light turned on for me that I learned that I can learn and I
started that creative process. Now I don‟t want to close the doors on left brainers. What I am trying to
say is, right brainers can easily, we‟ve been through into scary areas, unknown areas more often
because we are not afraid of it. Where left brainers are tend to be horrified of that. It‟s my hope that left
brainers find a way to overcome that fear and venture into that unknowing because that is where
growth inspiration, knowledge, and everything else comes from. I just want to be careful that I am not
closing the door on those left brainer type entrepreneurs that are listening to us.
Jermaine: No, absolutely. You know what‟s interesting Travis? I have this good friend of mine, John
Ashra. He will speak to you on the speaker. He claims that I am so left brain and we stood there and
argue. And I say, “I‟m right brain I am musical”. And he says, “No, I bet you, you think more on
numbers” and he is right. Even in the musical process there is a number, interbolic, it‟s about distance,
it‟s about relative pitches and it is very much mathematical and numerical. And so I really don‟t know I
am not the expert on the topic of left and right brain but he would swear I am a left brain. I‟d say I am
right but there is a mixture to be had between those two. I don‟t think it‟s one of the other, I know I‟ve
said I‟d take the right side that‟s it. Guns in my ear I have to choose one but I think there is a mixture to
be had and there are some benefits to be inclined to both.
Travis: Right. Well, I‟ve had this conversation with a lot of really brilliant people and it goes in a variety
of directions. Everybody is right and left brain and so when we talked about that, I feel strongly that God
start out as at one, one predominantly and it‟s up to you to develop the other. Then as you develop,
let‟s say you are highly over to the right side and the more you developed the left side the more well-
rounded and normally the more financial success you have, right?
Jermaine: Yes, right, right.
Travis: Because you balanced on both sides.
Jermaine: Absolutely. Because the going is saying is “the musicians are broke.” Peter say, “You have
money in music, you are a piano teacher.” I can‟t be that way, I can‟t be with what I do. I don‟t think the
success would have been as quick and as big relatively in my terms, but if I kept it that way. But yes

you are right, I have to venture off to the left side and I have to learn some other skills and traits and
discipline and knowledge to meet that gift that I have. Because the gift alone I don‟t believe would have
been enough. I don‟t think I am this extraordinary talented musician. I think I can teach little bit better
than the average but I don‟t think musically, my salary equates with my talent compared to the brilliant
people I bring into our office and record with but I met it with the other side and I think that made all the
difference for me personally.
Travis: Right, right. For me I think in numbers also. I see patterns where people don‟t see patterns. Do
you have that?
Jermaine: Yes, yes. In musical you have to see patterns and that‟s what I teach largely in our by ear
program is recognizing the recurring recycling patterns. If I played most songs are paddle patterns so
musically it‟s evident in my teaching.
Travis: Yeah.
Jermaine: And is a real pattern and remember things exactly.
Travis: Yeah. And so he could argue that is a left brain. I think that probably is a left brain part skill.
But I‟ve always been able to or maybe always is an over statement but I have been able to spot trends
and see things that are coming way ahead of time because I can see patterns. So it is clear as maybe
the writing on the wall to me until I started having conversations with people that it become clear to me
that they didn‟t see the same writing on the wall that I saw. Did you have that level of discovery in your
skills set and gift?
Jermaine: Oh, absolutely, absolutely, seeing patterns recognizing trends and that sort of thing. Yeah,
sometimes you are lonely and you can‟t find a lot of people to discuss this sort of things with the least I
can‟t but I am very much can relay to what you say there.
Sandra: Hey Travis, can I jump in for a second?
Travis: Yeah, yeah. Please do.
Sandra: Thank you. Wow, Jermaine, I‟m just kind of googling on you and looking for a little bit on the
internet. I want to make sure Travis and our listener know what a rock star you are. Because on this
page, it says, today more than 2 million people downloaded piano, organ, guitar and vocal lesson each
year and nearly 300,000 subscribed to his newsletter. Those numbers says Griggs translate to
business grossing millions of dollars. So I am hearing this and I‟m wondering how this 17 year old boy
who started this business based on his passion created such a gift to people. Can you tell us a little bit
more about your story and maybe some of the pitfalls along the way? Because clearly it‟s natural for

those of us entrepreneurs to maybe downplay ourselves just use to living in your own body that we
forget. But you are one extraordinary man and I want to find out more about you.
Jermaine: Well, thank you, thank you. I kind of always intersect their status story right around the 70
dollars story because I know the interview is going to take me a little bit further there. But after that
though obviously we didn‟t get to 2 million downloads and 300,000 subscribers and customers and 8
figures and online revenue since inception but it took awhile and for about 18 months we struggled. We
just wandered around in the wilderness like all did and that was in my college years. I remembered my
freshman year in college I searched for everything I could. I have this light bulb moment and I found
stories online where people were succeeding with their websites even in the infancy stage of the web
we are talking about 1999. I am Googling and I came across this one guy Corey Rudl and I found his
website and he was teaching internet marketing. So I bought his course and at that time I guess we
were probably making 300 dollars a month with the site. My girlfriend who‟s my wife now 14 years
later, we would go buy the books at the office store and ship them out and it was cute after school. We
go to Mickey Deez and we go buying some books. I get once a year every other day until I read this
particular course it was called “The Insider Secrets to Marketing Your Business Online.” It really
thought me about what we called Direct Response Marketing. Now I started learning how to offer and
convey the benefits of my program. I just assumed I could slap up a picture with 4 sentences like they
do in a catalogue. I thought that the world would come pushing my door in at the site.
Sandra: Right.
Jermaine: And it just didn‟t happen until I really aggressively started learning marketing and how to
present my offering in the best light and how to attract targeted people and how to build at least of fans
and how to cultivate the relationship. And just all of these things are new to me. Me and Travis had
this conversation, I am just very curious so when I come across which is something that is just so new I
get really invaded in I call it the “immersion technique.” Even in chess, my brother in law, he said that I
would never beat him in chess and he gave me until January 2, 2013, and this was two months ago. I
said, “I want to beat this guy in chess.” I just immerse myself in chess blogs and chess books and to
make the long story short I beat him the next week.
Sandra: I love it.
Jermaine: And I would beat him the whole time. He beat me a lot more but that‟s not the point. The
point was he told me I would never win. And so immersion and it was the same thing 14 or so years
ago. I immersed myself into this marketing thing. I remembered the day I went to sleep I‟ve changed
my website around from this 4 sentence catalogue thing to I remember this headline driven “Benefits for
a Driven Site.” I sent it out and I had built out a Yahoo groups. I didn‟t have a mailing list I just had a
group. I slept it out and I woke up in the next morning with $1100 in sales and you got email load, you

got mail, you got mail and it was orders. And I was like, “Oh my Gosh” and I called my wife, “I can‟t go
to Psychology class and you can‟t go either, we got to go and buy these books.” It was just an amazing.
That was my turning point.
Travis: Oh, I love it.
Jermaine: You guys I love my turning point. That was the day March 2, 2002 and it was the day that I
didn‟t even see 1100 dollars ever in one place prior to that. I didn‟t even think that my family did, it was
never any talks of savings it was always check to check.
Travis: Right
Jermaine: This had me that „pat in the back,‟ at least in the way it was for me.
Travis: Yeah.
Jermaine: What was a turning point for me and you know what sales didn‟t went to 300 dollars a day, it
didn‟t stay at 1100 but it papered down to about 300. At first month we would make 8,000 dollars from
one product in just a matter of me changing around my website and presenting things in a different
light.
Sandra: Wow.
Jermaine: It wasn‟t even more traffic yet. That got us to the next level but it was just my current traffic.
What I had managed to get was Guerrilla Marketing and posting in forms, all the things you do in web
at one point or back then. Just right around my head, cut off, posting, I knew I could that kind of traffic
with a different sales message led to that revolutionary month and we never looked back. Every month
always beat the previous month. Like for a several years in a row, until we found ourselves several
years later making half a brand I hadn‟t even graduated college yet. I was curious there‟s people
bailing out of college or leaving and grandma said, “You never leave college, you do not know what it
took to get here.” I stayed until I graduated but I was running a company at the same time and then a
few years later we would learn a little bit more and we get to 7 figures and fast forward. Now we have
this multi instrument, multi genre. I guess you could say a music publishing company that‟s helping a lot
of people. Christmas time I get stacks and stacks, hundreds and you‟ve probably say thousands of
Christmas cards and text messages and I feel like this as a personal bond with my customers. I think it
has a lot to do with my philosophy, my personalization, my relationship building, philosophy and
techniques and just keeping that at the forefront and knowing that I really want to have relationships. I
never want to get too big or have too much traffic or even maybe too many stories written about me or
it‟s for me to have a personal bond so that‟s always been my philosophy and it‟s worked out for us. I

guess I could say that is more of the end of the story, grandma says, “We are not really what we want
to be but we got to be thankful for what we are not really used to be” and that‟s always, that‟s always
my life.
Sandra: Beautiful.
Travis: That‟s an incredible story, I love it. Just hearing about when the light turned on for you just it
lights me up. It‟s such a magical turning point in your life and then the depth of satisfaction that you
have to be getting from. You‟re making a really incredible difference in people‟s lives and you have a
deep relationship with them. Is that super fulfilling for you?
Jermaine: Oh, absolutely, absolutely. Even if like my energy levels are low just for whatever reason. I
can go to my help desk and I ask that my team put all the very good comment. At first I ask that they
reply right away and I ask that the really exceptional once before they could use so that I can personally
reply because honestly a thousand emails a day I can‟t do that.
Travis: Right.
Jermaine: But we have a little system in place for me to see and then they are all stored in one
particular box. I mean I could go there and read it any given time thousands of email I can just pour
through at any given day and they uplift me. I know it sounds a little selfish.
Sandra: No.
Jermaine: But when I need to boost in the gas and the pump, I can go to that box and I could see all
these things from all around the world. Even places that would never be able to pay me they benefit
from my free offerings that are very, very plentiful I guess you could say, the lack of the word right now,
but yeah, it is just such a great experience. And it is all centered around music, speaking and my built
up love for business that came after 2002. But the other two were with me like I said since childhood
so it‟s this delusion and I think that‟s where happiness comes from. To be honest because I live now in
the places like a lot of professionals and so I talked to lawyers. And I told, “You know I am supposed to
be a lawyer, I went to school for that.” They said, “You don‟t want to be a lawyer, you pick the right
one.”
Travis: Right.
Jermaine: I don‟t know if it was bad, I don‟t know if that‟s just a joke or whatever I would see that they
do well for themselves but a lot of people are kind of stuck in things that they do for means, for making
a living. Not really in their gut what they enjoy. I feel like I would be doing this for free even when I am
retired, whenever that comes I feel like I would still be doing this. I don‟t think I would just stop
everything and watch TV all day or even at the top of the world.

Travis: Yeah.
Jermaine: But I think I would still be doing this. I think that‟s a good sign of a place where you were
probably meant to do what you do.
Travis: Right.
Jermaine: No one ever knows you know what they says you like I was meant to do this you could only
go by faith but I would say that my faith tells me that I am in a place I should be.
Travis: Yeah, I would be...
Sandra: You are making such a difference...Wow!
Travis: I‟m sorry dear, say that again?
Sandra: No, you are just making such a difference in everything, every bit of joy sounds like you get to
make a difference for others. Jermaine it sounds like you really care and in that you get it back tenfold.
Travis: Plus he focuses on giving and that‟s first, and that‟s the missing piece with so many people and
I know I see a lot of people re-crafting their messages to give a little first but they are still not focused
on giving incredible value so you‟ve taken until to that level Jermaine to where you not you only give but
you are giving incredible value. And that builds rapport, that builds a lifetime relationship like you said
some people aren‟t in the financial position to buy stuff but you still help them in giving them that value
and that‟s where that depth of relationship comes from. I don‟t think people like you, Sandra, myself
and our listener can be fit into the box of that 9 to 5 were creative, we want to make a difference. I
agree you chose wisely I don‟t think you could fit into that box and felt the level of fulfilment that you
have now.
Jermaine: I agree. It was a chance, it was a risky thing. I told my family I would be ripping up my Law
school application, after under that to pursue this full time even though I was widely successful and
people knew it and still they didn‟t believe that it was sustainable. That it‟s just the key thing you‟re
doing now while you‟re still in school but you better do that real thing. And even to this day it depends
how I introduce what I do because everybody is really focused in what you do. And so if I say piano
teacher if I really want to mess with them I say, “Piano teacher.” And then their eyes get big and say, “I
don‟t get it.” I can say instructional music publishing or I can just say I help people to harness their gifts
to play music by ear. But society deems what you‟re supposed to do is not always what you‟re
supposed to do. I‟ve always „gone against the grain‟ and I have reaped the benefits personally and I
have also been able to help people and so I guess I wouldn‟t have it any other way. I just got to go in
another direction.

Travis: Yeah I think this is a great conversation to have because entrepreneurs, the reason why we
say the entrepreneur‟s radio show because there are people who are thinking about the move to being
a business owner and then of course there are people who are business owners and you‟re hitting on
something that is an important topic. Our family the ones that love us, your grandmother taught you all
these great skills; she was teaching you to be a great person. That just happens to be some of the
great elements that you need, or the elements that you need to be a speaker and business person and
all those other things.
Jermaine: Right.
Travis: But here‟s the rub, when it‟s time for you to get off the beaten path, and tear up that or not go
down the path of being an attorney and become an entrepreneur that‟s when the family that loves you
and supports you normally become the opposite. It‟s out of love that they „rain on your parade.‟
Jermaine: You know what; I have this specific story too that really seize on that, I mean protection.
They want to protect you and it‟s all out of love most of the time at least. I don‟t know why I told the
story of Corey Rudl, the author of that “Course”. Now, he passed away ironically at the speedway. He
was racing these exotic cars, one of the bigger accidents on the decade on this particular track, and he
is longer with us as of 2005. He was an angel. He was a great person. I reached out to him after
having success with his course. Do know that he personally came to meet me. I got to go to events
with him. We became friends, from customers to friends. Kind of like I have that bond I have with
others. This guy to me was on top of the world. That means multi-mullion dollar business in 1999.
Imagine what he‟d be doing today. I remember the day that he said, “I want to come meet you.” I knew
he had a Ferrari from his videos and interviews online and I told all my family, “this guy with the Ferrari
with this million dollar businesses is going to come to college apartment and he was going to meet me.”
What do you think the first reply was from them anyway? “You better be careful that’s a stalker. That’s
not the right person. He is going to murder you and chop you up. Say no, don’t do it.” Coming from his
domain name, he has a real company. I am not dumb. I am in college. I think I am a smart guy. I think
it‟s him. But they warned me to kingdom come and I ignored it and it was him. That was an inspiring
day as well. He drove to my office 20 miles away in kind of the hood back then. He didn‟t mind, he
came, he parked his Ferrari right across from the warehouse. I remember him telling me, you got to
have people in here making business happen because I have people binding books, shipping stuff. I
thought I was in business. I had people. I had family, I had friends and we were doing stuff but we
weren‟t doing the right thing. He was kind of like my Rich Dad Poor Dad scenario. He said you got to
clean house. You got to have people working on producing business. I remember after that day I got a
fulfilment house. I outsourced everything that didn‟t produce business and that was my second turning
point. It got me on the road of having this lean business. Not valuing myself by the number of
employees I had or infrastructure or physical local are valued by real results, tangible results and
people and return of investment. That was just the story of family. If I would have listened, they were

sincere about it, but it was just that other moment of faith and going against the grain and this was on
my tender age of 18. Sometimes you just have to take that leap. Sometimes you have to plug your ears
and if you think and your gut tells you, „you are on the right track, this is something that you really want
to do and you‟re plugged in to the right help or expert and you trust them and you feel that connection.
Just go for it. I am just so thankful that I went for it and that is one of things I think I am thankful for
everyday that we went for and we‟re still going for it. So my advice is Go for it!
Travis: Yeah. I agree. You‟re always going to have the family there to love and support you on those
other levels. But there are times when you have to get out of that nest and you are going to surround
yourself with fellow entrepreneurs, there are a couple of things that I want to double back to. The lesson
within that story is to place more of your staff on the emphasis of growing the business rather than
serving or producing the business. Correct?
Jermaine: Yes. It‟s more of a pull activity versus being reactive. So everything I had people at that
point was reactive to what had already happened.
Travis: Exactly.
Jermaine: We are sending out orders and hoping that the next ones come in from my efforts in the
past. But we weren‟t proactively creating. That was a shift for me. He gave that to me in 2003. Practice
passing, I am thankful for that and when you hear.
Travis: So your emphasis was on the wrong place.
Jermaine: Yes, absolutely, even though we were had that amount of success. You can still be
successful and still do the wrong things. It‟s just one thing works for me at that point and we just had to
learn from our mistakes. That‟s the great thing about entrepreneurship it is a journey and never the
destination.
Travis: The reason why I am circling back to this is this is a common problem in almost every business.
You were 2 bad months away from being out of business.
Jermaine: Yeah, I could have been.
Travis: Something could have happened beyond your control. A catastrophic event, something and
most businesses are so focussed on producing what it is that they do and very little effort on creating or
keeping the pipeline full. That you are one or two months away from catastrophic failure, maybe 3
months, just guessing from my perspective. So that is a super, super valuable lesson that I wanted to
highlight in what you said there. Because I agree with you that something like that is a turning point
once you get that as a business owner, right?

Jermaine: Absolutely, absolutely. A lot of people I know, particularly local and small businesses, I
mean they get a lot of referrals and they do a great job producing and people consume or proud of the
results that they bring. So they invite their friends and I hear a lot of people say, “I‟ve never had to do
an ounce of marketing and advertising in my life.” They are saying it out of pride but I‟m thinking, well,
what happens when that well gets dry? Or that pipeline or people stop talking about you or people are
consumed with their own problems that they don‟t think to talk to their friends about you and that sort of
thing. So I think you always have to be on that proactive side, referrals and that sort of thing. One part
of your chain of strategies and tactics, but you really do have to invest time in marketing, being
proactive in the business that you want to generate. That is my turning point back then that‟s when we
went to work in Google, Pay per click advertising, SEO, putting people to work, calling leads and
following up and that sort of thing. It was a great turning point. That year we doubled. I remember
hitting getting past the half a million dollar mark and I hit it almost to the million dollar mark because of
that piece of advice.
Sandra: What was that like when all these numbers started growing from the boy playing his
grandma‟s piano.
Jermaine: You know quite frankly, I always told my wife in those years, I don‟t know if I was a little
jaded now. It‟s kind of like we increased our numbers and we grow. It‟s one year though in 2009 we did
double our net profit. I mean being able to double everything like that and that was happening in the
early years it was like 200, 400, 800 you know. 1.5, it was just happening. I remember how I felt back
then, I didn‟t have any expenses and I was living in my dorm and eventually I got married, buy my first
house, and started investing in property. It was like a dream because and obviously I went in and I got
my dream car and I had a few do that and things and then I got settled and got back on track. I
remember the feeling I had then, I don‟t quite have that feeling as much. I guess it was just so new, it
was so novice. I never experienced that before. 14 years later you get a little used to it, but yeah, I
always tell my wife, I mean for that to happen for me to feel that way again I guess I have to make 50
million dollars. I don‟t know but it‟s a process.
Travis: Yeah, it‟s normal what you go through Jermaine. It‟s the normal process. I built my business
for 70 million and I have become very jaded and it just got to where that NASA had to land a rocket in
my front yard to surprise me. It‟s a terrible way, for me it was a terrible way to live because most
people would not get to enjoy the excitement that everybody else was enjoying because I have become
so desensitized of things. But there‟s other ways to progress through that and even one of the things
that I wanted to cover with you I want to talk about what you teach also because that is a super critical
part that I want our listener to understand is that the loneliness that entrepreneurs, I experienced it,
Sandra experiences it, so you‟re not alone there and you have get around like minded people. You
have to be involved and that‟s really the big part of why we created this show, is because #1 success is
presented in this light of perfection, where I think so many of the entrepreneurs felt like that they were

lesser, or they were idiots, or they are naive. Because they are not as flawless and as successful as
everybody else that has the Ferraris. The real truth is that it was a journey to get there and I want
people to know about the journey and I want them to know who the people are who really can fast
forward their journey. And also selfishly we wanted to build a community, because we wanted to be
surrounded by people like you and Sandra that help us feel like we fit in. Because we don‟t fit in many
other places right?
Jermaine: Right. Absolutely.
Travis: I fit in with my family, I love my sisters, I love my father, I love all of them but from an
entrepreneur‟s stand point, everybody, people say things that they are excited, they tried this year and
all other stuff, well I am excited about accomplishments. I am excited about helping people. I am
excited about a whole different set of things and that‟s why as entrepreneurs were so very different
from everybody else.
Jermaine: Now that can‟t be further from the truth Travis. You know what irritates me, and I think God
put my brother in law for this reason. But this guy is good at everything. Like he‟s the one who beats
me at chess, Xbox, he has this process of knowledge. He‟s living with us but he has practical
knowledge of everything else, and I feel that because I put my intention in entrepreneurship in building
my business and marketing there is this very narrow like part of me that knows something to the T very
well but I skip the Xbox, I skip the Gameboy when I was 12, I skipped the chess. It is hard sometimes to
resonate or know what is going on and wrecking on some stuff and just walk into the room and play
John Madden Football. That‟s hard but I can go make 5 figures or 6 figures in a day and that‟s easy but
sometimes it frustrates me so I get to work and try to do normal stuff like buy basketball DVDs because
I got to fit in with the guys, I got to make my free throws and then I go buy Chess. I mean since for
being real about the struggles that kind of been trade off, that‟s my personal trade off that I know this
marketing all of my books I‟m so business minded and I feel like it serves me very well. I don‟t take that
back but sometimes my other fields in the regular world with regular 9 to 5 folks I kind of fall short a little
bit sometimes.
Travis: Hey, same thing here. People ask me like “hey, how about those Texans? I don‟t follow sports.
Jermaine: Me neither. Tall, black guy, 200 lbs. I mean they just know I‟m following Kobe and I‟m really
Matt.
Travis: Yeah, I‟m 6 feet tall 200 lbs. Everybody thinks I‟m a football fan. “Man,” I said “I can‟t even tell
you when the Super bowl is.” So you know I just don‟t focus on those things so I get your pain.
Jermaine: A very good pain. Not bad at all.

Travis: There‟s a lot more Pros than Cons. Hey let‟s segue into some of your brilliance one of the
things that we want to get out there that we haven‟t covered is you have the wisdom of a 70 year old
but you‟re only 28 or 29.
Jermaine: 29. I‟ll be going 30 on June.
Sandra: Wow.
Travis: You‟re ahead of your time by many, many years my friend and so kudos to you on that. Let‟s
segue into some of things that you do. Break it down into layman‟s terms how you can set up a system
that is so responsive that people have a deep relationship.
Jermaine: Oh absolutely. Well it comes down to this term called marketing automation. The word
automation, when people hear that word, and you kind of alluded to this in the beginning it brings about
feelings of robotic or the little things that puts the chips in the bag and fill it in and push it on in a
warehouse or something. But we managed to put automation in personal in the same sentence without
it being an actually moron and that‟s using the power of technology.
And so when you think of marketing automation, some things that come to mind that people will
probably get right away is using technology to follow customers. Being able to set up a series of
messages that when someone fills out a form in a website or joins your mailing list, not only are they
getting that ten messages that says thank you for joining my list, that‟s just very common. But they are
getting a set of messages into the future that are predetermined to go out. That is a very basic level,
that‟s what everybody thinks what automation is. Or maybe a system that can tell you when to send
John Doe a letter at this point in time after they buy. Or maybe a cued up task for your phone to give
somebody a call that‟s another layer of marketing automation and also something very common. Or
maybe a system that you press a button after you talked to a customer out shoots a letter to your mail
house for them. Or maybe an email in your behalf that kind of covers what you have talked about that
it‟s all ready to go and that it just merges in the information. That‟s automation. But I take it a step
further those are the things that already exist in most I guess you could say CRM (Customer
Relationship Management) System but I take it a step further and I created this philosophy that I
coined as Scaling Personal Attention is really about duplicating Jermaine Griggs. The regular Jermaine
is a big old teddy bear that just has a heart of gold. I‟m the one who stops on the freeway and I roll
down my window and I give that money. Even if I have done it all day in every freeway and exit, I can‟t
say no, I‟ll buy all those Boy Scout cookies from every door. Other people say that I already bought
some. I‟m saying “Well okay, here‟s another 10 bucks I‟m just scaling that I‟m the same old Jermaine
but I‟m saying on one end I know face to face is the best most effective form of communication is face
to face. I can‟t be face to face it‟s not leverage able. So how do I create that seemingly face to face
experience with my customers and the way I found to do that is to CRM systems and I don‟t know if you

want to get specific on which system that I use they are all the same concept. What really they allow
you to do is they allow you to collect a database were almost 400,000 now of people and those people
aren‟t just data in your database, but they are real clients with records. It‟s kind of like a record of their
own that I can go to your name and I can see everything that you have done on my website through
this technology that now exists. For the common person, I can see that Travis clicked on my last email.
I can see Sandra read my last blog post or watched my video. Not only that, but there is this new
technology where I can tag and I can label certain things that you do so that I can say that not only did
Travis do it but I have this record, these tags of him doing that particular action and now that I can keep
track of the things that he is doing. Things that he clicked and stuff, well now I can actually use that
data. It‟s not like Web 1.0, okay I see what my visitors are doing, I see what pages they are viewing, I
see how long they are in my website, web 2.0 or 3.0, where were going is we can use the data. To me,
you have a tag that says you have read the report. How do you reply to that scaling person who‟s
sensitive? Well if you have the tag, your next email will be “Hey Travis, I just want to commend you for
reading that report yesterday, and I know that if you have read it, and because you have read it, I know
you have some amazing concepts or strategies. Or if it was my piano niche, “Hey, thanks for watching
that first video, in fact because you watched that 1st
video you know the #1 skill that musicians need to
have which is learning how to find the key of the song here‟s your next video. If you don‟t consume we
back up and say “Hey Travis, I noticed that I released a video to you and you haven‟t watched it. So it‟s
just really down to the basic level of knowing what to do and being able to follow up and run things
based on whether you have the tags that I‟m looking for that you should have or you don‟t. So I can do
things when you do stuff, and I can do things with the lack thereof. That‟s pretty much the foundation of
my system that I just take to the nth degree. Just trying to be very reactive and instead of people say
“This can‟t be automated.” I mean how does he keep up with all these stuff that I‟m doing?” In
everything there‟s a human layer on top.
Sandra: Wow.
Jermaine: So there are tags In the Infusion Soft, how do I make that tag real? That tag says you‟ve
done something but what does that tag really mean? And how can I convey that to you? I guess you
can say that it is the foundation of the philosophy.
Travis: Yeah, let me add some commentary to that. So many people do in their messages is they
constantly or regularly blast messages that are not relevant to the stage where that person is.
Jermaine: Yeah.
Travis: And yours, your information is tailored to where they are today and what they have and have
not done and so it‟s much like when I teach the salesman of one of my companies. We have to make
sure that we are at proper stage before we do make an offer, right?

Jermaine: Yeah.
Travis: Well it‟s the same thing. What you‟re doing here is you want people to have a certain level of
knowledge or understanding before you make an offer and that is just one example right?
Jermaine: Yeah. That is just one example. Like Web 1.0, we would set up this same kind of
communication. They are called auto responders. How I‟ve used to do it is you come on my list and I
might send you my free video, I might send you another lesson and on day 7 I‟ll make my 1st
offer. But
it really had nothing to do with whether you were ready, whether you were consuming or not, whether
you were even with me or liked me, I mean you signed up that doesn‟t really mean that you‟re really
raising your hand, and now it‟s all responses. You don‟t get your 1st
offer in a predetermined amount of
time. You get your first offer when you meet a certain amount of threshold or you passed a certain
threshold. Now this tag based system people are now familiar with tags. It‟s not just not in customer
relationship management. You know you blog, and when you blog you enter tags of things about
whatever the topic or subject at hand right on Facebook. You can tag an image. Basically tagging is
describing something. So now, we have tags about our customers that the predetermined things that
say, and you know what, the more tags that somebody has in their account meaning they have
probably done more things when they are tagging people when they click or when I‟m tagging people
when they do this and that. You know what, there‟s a correlation between how much I have to scroll on
their account, and how much they are actually worth to us. There‟s a pattern or correlation. The more
they do the better quality customer the more they raise their hand and then you know, there ways to
say “Hey!” when they have this tag then now you make your offer. So it‟s the same thing as your sales
rep. Sales reps have the advantage of listening for cues and real human interaction. I don‟t have that
interaction but you know what my ears, my ears are my tags and all I‟m doing is listening with the
advantage of having that tag exist forever. My human capacity could never remember.
Travis: You know Jermaine, that‟s a great way to of putting that. Is that your tags are your ears; it‟s a
great way for people like me to get a grasp. Okay, so you‟re not sitting in front of that person. Because
there are so many things, I can read facial expressions, all that other stuff we don‟t have that benefit
with automation. But your tags being your ears or your eyes reading what is going on that is a brilliant
way of driving home your point there.
Jermaine: Yeah, I probably automate in listening, automated listening. That‟s how you do it.
Travis: Now it seems overwhelming how do I engineer this whole thing? How do I write this content?
How do I do all of this stuff? To the average person who has already got a 50-60 hour job what‟s the
answer to that?
Sandra: That‟s my question as well.

Jermaine: Okay when I first adopted this automation strategy let‟s say at my old journey, this was
probably around 2008. I‟ve almost got just as many years doing it the other way, as I had been doing it
what I call the right way. I have the advantage of seeing it from both sides a very manual system and to
now very automated, but all at the same time a very personal. Like people get birthday cards and
greeting cards just this past Christmas, all my gospel folks is that I don‟t want to send anybody who
might not be into the religious holiday part of it. But all my gospels get a text message saying Merry
Christmas. I got 300 replies back on Christmas on my phone.
Sandra: Wow.
Jermaine: All that because of tags as well, so every little thing that I could know about you. There are
two ways to know about you right there. There is external data and there is the internal data. External is
what you tell me. We are all familiar with Web forms and surveys I can just outright ask you „what is
your favourite style?‟ I can ask you, what is your skill level, your current level. I can ask you what your
goals are, how long are you going to reach a goal. How serious you are, if you ever hired a teacher in
the past. That‟s external stuff, but the internal stuff is just what you do. If you‟re clicking a link about
Jazz, well, I‟m noting that. If you click another link about Jazz you got 2 things in your account about
Jazz. I could act on that information. But going back to your question, how do you start? Well you
start with your first email. And what happens when you get into behavioural marketing it‟s a natural
progression. Unlike other forms of marketing where you think you have to know the secret language of
copywriting and this push button words and those help I learned that back with Corey Rudl‟s course,
benefits and headlines and that sort of thing. With behavioural marketing it‟s just really human
interaction. What would say to this person if you had him on the phone, and you are following up to see
if they watched your introductory orientation video on your accounting video or it‟s really what it is and
anybody can use this philosophy. It‟s taking whatever you do, I don‟t care if you‟re a lawyer,
accountant, dentist, and find whatever the information is in what you do. You may think you provide a
service. But there‟s so many questions that need to be answered that have to do with your service that
if you actually took the time to sit down and pull out that information. With dentistry, what are the
different types of fillings that I can get? Or I‟m interested in cosmetics veneers and what does that
mean. Just taking the time to do maybe a webinar, record it, as a dentist something totally outside the
norm and recording that. Now when people come to your website, they can request that video. But
before you talk to them or have your finite assistant who only has so much finite time to get on the
phone. Having a system in place that knows okay what was they thinking to watch it will tag them.
Okay what kind of email would you naturally send them? What would you naturally say? You probably
thank them. Okay, so let‟s write that. Say thank you for watching my video. What would you do next?
You probably acknowledge something in that video. You probably want to underscore and you would
lead them to whatever the next step is. The next step maybe “Hey, why don‟t we sit down and do a
consultation?” Or “Why don‟t you call us to schedule your type of phase? What happens when they do

that? Well, we now got them offline. Now we have made the consultation and things are great. But
what happens when they don‟t? Well we can have the next step ready to go out and so the next step is
very natural stuff. No secret language or copywriting or extra skills. It‟s just regular writing. You can‟t
go wrong just writing a regular letter to a friend and that‟s kind of how I start out.
Travis: Yeah, it‟s just common sense right?
Jermaine: It just a lot of common sense and over time I got so intrigue, my curiosity mindset that I just
ask this what happens if I add this, and then I added this. And in this chain that and you add another
product and you can really take it to the moon you really don‟t have to worry about the idea. Really it
starts with “Hey, what is my end goal?” The goal may be to get a consultation. Can I put some
information out there to get people interested, the desire is hungry to what I have to offer. Just keep
them on what we call the straight line and use behavioural marketing to do it and your tags again are
your ears. If they fit the tags, push them forward. If they don‟t give them a little nudge in the right
direction. That‟s really is the action reaction process that‟s it 2 steps Action- Reaction.
Travis: Right. I think so many people get caught up, now writing is a skill to succinctly say what you
want to say.
Jermaine: Yes.
Travis: But I feel like I‟m worn down with all the sales e-messages that I get from everybody. Offer
ends tonight at 12:30, at times you do have to make offers but they haven‟t spent any time with me
building value and that wears me down. Rather than being a welcomed guest they are pest to me right.
I would really rather talk to me in a straight forward way, rather than all of the gimmicky stuff that‟s
going on. I think that‟s what you‟re eluding to is just talk in a natural way right in a way that would you
say this to person if they were sitting in front of you right?
Jermaine: Absolutely. That is one of the shifts if who they are, you know what they are doing. You can
now have a one on one personal tone. It‟s not this corporate speak tone. It‟s not this persuasion-style
tone. There are times to be persuasive and my take on persuasion is and ethics and how those things
collide is at some point if the person is doing everything that I have expected him to do, meaning their
account is tag heavy. They got every tag that he could possibly get right? Every email ready to tag him
when they click has been clicked. Okay this person is in to me, this person needs what I have got, and
they have shown it. Well now there comes this part in the world where I say, “Okay, I have an
obligation now or responsibility to put my offer in front of them in the light that makes them respond and
to give them an incentive. Now it‟s not a fake gift. It‟s not what you have to learn tonight. But there are
bonuses, legitimate bonuses, a legitimate bonus in my sequence there are pages that automatically
expires using a technology. You know programmers here and there. A very easy way, I really expire my
pages when we use that particular strategy it isn‟t that fake thing, and that‟s giving them back the help

them to help themselves. But that type is something in the past before this philosophy came upon me.
It would be for everybody and it would be a predetermined amount of time. Now it is to the person that
it should be to actually build up that relationship and rapport, and they know me enough, they clicked
12 things, 15 things, I say Jermaine Griggs and they know that name for sure. They‟re not going to say
who‟s this guy? And he is offering me something in red. I know them and it‟s been this back and forth
action- reaction I think. You know what kind of conversions we see from our sequence versus our
straight website? Our straight website averages about 1 to 2% just like anybody else. It was a great
conversion rate but nothing outside of the direct response norm through email and our followers 10, 15,
20%.
Travis: 30%
Jermaine: And there are times when it‟s 30% as well. 30% I would probably be super rich.
Travis: I have read a lot of your stuff; I expect it to be 30% because you‟re that good.
Jermaine: I have to get one alive a little bit more to get 30% so if they get to a live event it will be 30%
tell a seminar, webinar, I‟m just talking to everybody that comes through and were talking about 500
people a day to get 10, 15, sometimes 20% live events so that it will get high but open rate is 60% click
through rate 30%. Even in my automation clinic world. I mean it‟s not unheard of I need to send an
email that‟s a much smaller list on my consulting side 3,000 people. It‟s not uncommon for me to have
1500 people to read out of the 3,000 or so people and the good thing is a thousand of them to click.
Very much smaller number but very higher ticket item on my consulting side. But yeah, it‟s the same
philosophy it‟s that value creation. It‟s people when they see Jermaine Griggs on their box they know
they are going to get value and some being in a great proportions that if I am offering anything. The
proportional value to offer is definitely going to be a very positive twist of value creation. Even when I
am offering something it‟s an extension of the value that I have already created and it‟s for the ones
that really do want to take it further with me.
Travis: You know were running short on time, and there‟s so many things to talk about. We could go
down the road. One of the things that I really like about you even before I met you is you get the value
of only saying something when you have something to say. There are so many people who are saying
unnecessary things that have taken up our time and wasting. We are all very busy and that is a
currency in itself. I trust you, when I see steps from you I trust you because I know you are not going to
take up my time with nonsense. We could do half a show on that and branch into so many other things,
and actually I would like for you to consider maybe coming back and doing the show again a little later
down the road. I want to segue into the part of the show, we do have 3 questions. We do love an
organic conversation that just happens naturally. And then, there are 3 questions that I want to send to
you in advance because I want to give you some time to think about it, and give us an answer that you

have thought of for awhile. Because these are not easy, simple off the hip answers for everybody. So
let‟s segment into that and let me ask you, what book or program made an impact on you related to
your business that you would recommend to others and why?
Jermaine: That is a very hard question. I don‟t know if the emphasis is on one book because I actually
wrote down categories of books. I couldn‟t just pick one out of these. I‟d say this one is for this
category. This one is for that category. So do you mind me telling the category? Do you want me to
make a…
Travis: No go ahead.
Jermaine: Ok so when it comes to selling, persuasion as you just talked about hands down this book
“Influence” by Robert Cialdini just changed my life. He gave 6 or it may have been 7. Six levels of
influence. In like, I knew some of it, but he put the names, and he put the educational academic
research behind. And it just made it make sense reciprocity, commitment, existence, authority, scarcity,
social proof. I mean I just quote that book so much and it‟s really settled with me. Of course I‟ll be
remising if I mention this “Course” by Corey Rudl. He‟s not even around anymore. Corey passed away
in 2005 but you might be able to find something on eBay. I mean it was on the Internet on 2002 but it
was the “The Insider Secrets of Marketing your business in the Internet.” And that‟s it, I had just to
throw that in out of respect for him. Of course, in the realm of self help and personal development
“Think and Grow Rich.” I don‟t want to be a cliché but really that book just really opened my eyes to the
possibilities of thinking positively and affirmation and speaking things into existence, but also taking
action and just getting around the right folks. I mean, he just kinds of covers it so finely.
Travis: I agree with you.
Jermaine: And then, on like a more of a non, this is still business but just a general insight kind of thing
“Outliers” by Malcolm Gladwell which was a great book and talks about mastery and people who get to
the top in whatever it is that they do. He talks about the 10,000 hour rule. That it takes 10,000 hours to
master something. He talked about what‟s the like s of guys like Bill Gates and Steve Jobs and people
have in common. And it came down to birthdays. Like all the big computer guys were born on like
1955, 1956. But all the hockey people were born on the winter, January or they are the oldest in their
class. So they get that edge up. Then I started thinking about my generation, born on the 80s. Where‟s
the Mark Zuckerberg and the Internet guys and it got me thinking about my children. Kids who were
born in 2006 and 2007 what is going to be the thing that we as parents could expose them to so that
when opportunity leaps they are prepared for it. That‟s what Outliers got me stung on things like
opportunity, preparation, and just how things happen. Like the steel guy born in like 1856 of UNS or
something like that. If you were into steel and Andrew Carnegie knows guy opportunity was what that
book was all about. Then “4 Hour Work Week” that‟s the book that really encapsulates what I really

seek to have with here and play. I have been on crossroads where I wanted a high rise building with
hundreds of employees and keeping it lean, automated and outsourced and having people that really
drives the business and what‟s it amount to these days is the 4 Hour Work Week will just crystallize
what I am already blowing in. I‟m sorry about I‟m always like over the top. I can never answer the
question but.
Sandra: It‟s all good.
Travis: Well you know, what‟s interesting is that the 4 Hour Work Week. He focuses on metal learning
which is really kind of like a contrast to Malcolm Gladwell‟s Outliers which is 10,000 hours.
Jermaine: It is.
Travis: You know which is fine; everybody doesn‟t have to have the same conclusion anyways. What‟s
really interesting how he focuses on rapidly Tim Ferris that is the author of 4 Hour Work Week focuses
on quickly learning something and applying it. I have read all 4 of those books and they are great
books, excellent recommendation, thank you for that.
Jermaine: Yeah, absolutely. Sometimes you just have to suppose these things together get in where
you fit in with the philosophy. In music I don‟t know if you can metal learn your scales you‟ve got to
practice if want to get clean. In cooking maybe you can piece together a dish that taste professional.
Travis: Hey, so what is one of your favourite tools or pieces of technology that you have recently
discovered if any that you would recommend to other businesses owners and why?
Jermaine: Well the technology that I was talking about that allows the tagging and all of that stuff is
Infusionsoft. I mean my business wouldn‟t be the same if we hadn‟t switched our back in 2008. Infusion
Soft is a CRM that will allow you to start automating and following up with your customers and doing it
in a behavioural responsive kind of way. But you also said recent so something recent like write off the
press for me is this new tool that we have been using in our company called Sparkle video scribe. It‟s
just an ingenious tool you know, now just the Web does progress so you‟re seeing a lot of video
presentations with this cartoon hand written thing going on. Where it‟s literally a camera over hand that
illustrating whatever the presenter is talking about right?
Travis: Right?
Jermaine: Before now you kind of pay 5, 10, 15 thousand dollars for a specialized company to actually
hand do this for you and record it and speed it up. But now Sparkol S-P-A-R-K-O-L has this video
scribe thing and it literally does the same thing. You put in clip art you can find clip art online and next
thing you can literally you can have someone in your team, if you‟re inclined to do it you should really
make this captivating video scribe I guess presentations if you will, and that‟s really,

Travis: How much does it sell?
Jermaine: It‟s like a hundred bucks and they even have a I think 7 day trial with full of functionality and
you can get in there and make video style I guess so that answers your recent part as Infusion Soft has
been in my life for awhile now.
Travis: Right. Hey, what famous quote would summarize your belief or attitude in business?
Jermaine: I think it goes beyond business, but it has lot to do with it. I have 1, 2, 3, 4, I have 5 quotes
on my wall in my office here, but the one that sits right in front of me is by Mary Anne Williamson no
stranger to most folks but it says, and I quote “Our deepest fears is not that we are inadequate. Our
deepest fear is that we are powerful beyond measure. It is the light not our darkness that most
brightens us. We ask ourselves, who am I to be brilliant, gorgeous, talented, and fabulous. Actually who
are you not to be, you are a child of God and you are playing small doesn’t serve the world.” And that‟s
what this writing is all about.
Sandra: Love that.
Travis: Yes, I love it too.
Jermaine: So that personal that‟s everything my being small does not serve the world. I really have to
sometimes when I do want to be just plain old humble Jermaine and the humility says a lot here. I don‟t
think she was talking against humility, but just that our actions going out to make a really different to
know that we are able to and not to be scared of that unknown, that right brain unknown. You can get
on this car and not know what we are going to talk about. Just don‟t be afraid of that unknown and
don‟t let it frighten you because we are a lot more powerful than we think can be major event that‟s
happened, we put a tube up in the sky now it flies us from one corner of the world to another corner you
know that was somebody saying “I‟m not play small, I‟m going to go for it. If they can do it, I never
thought that I was different than any other great world changing person and I think many of us are. We
think there‟s this like upper entry line and these people are different and are super stars or Oprah or I
never thought that I was different. Or I have to train myself to think that I‟m not different from Oprah.
One day our paths will cross, I know, I‟m confident about it, and I know that I will do something great.
My grandma said “we’re not what we want to be, but we’re not what we used to be.” I think it‟s always a
journey. I think it‟s going to happen and so that‟s the quote that reminds me of that personally.
Sandra: Wow, thanks Jermaine.
Travis: Well Jermaine, I would like to sign up to help hold you accountable for that.

Jermaine: Well, please do. I don‟t know how large it‟s going to take to, but I have full faith that
something really big, even bigger than I have been blessed to see I think is going to happen. My plans
small when I serve it that‟s all.
Travis: Our belief mine and Sandra, and I don‟t speak for Sandra, the reason why I know is that it‟s our
belief is we have talked about it is we can achieve these incredible things by linking our arms together. I
feel like I have made a new friend and spending this time with you. You and I connect on many levels
beyond the fact that you are just a super great person and so I want to commit to staying connected
with you and helping you along that path and growing together in this network of entrepreneurs that we
have brought together to help and teach and inspire others. So thank you for everything that you have
done in the time that we have spent together, Sandra do you want to jump in?
Sandra: Sure. Jermaine you are such an inspiration and you are so lovable. It‟s just so clear that follow
the passion, you never give up, and you care, and there‟s so much love that comes through from your
voice and who you are being for other people and I‟m really excited about building better customer
relation with people that I have and even just building that bond and friendship and it all stems from
caring. So I really want to acknowledge you. You are extraordinary and what a gift you have been to us
today so thank you. Thank you for spending time with us, and I look forward into keeping in touch with
you also.
Jermaine: My pleasure, my pleasure and thank you both for having me and for this opportunity to
speak to your audience and speak with you. I‟ve got blessed. It‟s always great talking about things that
I‟m passionate about you can never go wrong.
Travis: We are going to do this again I promise you.
Sandra: Well how do our listeners find you? What‟s your website let‟s not forget about that.
Jermaine: Sure, I have 2. My primary is hearandplay.com that is if you are so inclined to do the music
thing. Or you want to start playing by ear and pick up some patterns I can allow you to play a lot of
songs out there. If hearandplay.com is your place, or if you just want to see the personal space in a
real form. Go over there and sign up and you‟ll see what exactly I‟m talking about, you‟ll know, you‟ll be
laughing in your seat, you‟ll say he must have tagged me, because you got the emails. And automation
clinic is where Travis found me and that‟s where people asked me over the years, “hey talk about hear
and play,” if you just tell me your insights I think it‟s a natural progression for a business person to
figure something out. They go and they just share insights about it. So, automationclinic.com it‟s just
information, blogs and videos, I don‟t even have a course over there yet. I‟m actually in the midst of
wrapping up to much my first ever informational course in that space but it‟s just blogging and my
insights, some webinar recordings and you can a little bit more of kind of what we started on this

conversation over there. So that‟s the 2 sides of me and the 2 sides that keep me busy, other than
family, kids, and my wife and that sort of thing. Thank you guys for having me again.
End of Interview
Travis: Let me segue into reminding you that we have put up a, for the longest we have sent you to
travisandsandra.com which of course you can go there. But also, instead of typing that all in, you can
just type diyob.com so that stands for Diamonds In Your Own Backyard. So D-I-Y-O-B (dot) com and
enter your name and we‟ll send you the 2013 business owner‟s guide „From Frustration to 70 million
dollars‟ guide and behind the scenes look at what you need to know to grow your business to an
incredible levels of success. Also, we are in the process of setting up a private area that everyone that
is a part of our community. You will get access to our private rolodex - the people, the resources,
meaning the tools that we used that we recommend. We will have this set up for you in a couple of
weeks and then everything we do is dedicated to giving you the shortest path to the next level of
success for you and your business. This way you instantly have the connections that myself and
Sandra has had, rather than guessing who you can and cannot trust, you can go straight to those
resources. Unfortunately for the first several years of the Internet for me, I had to go through this trial
and error process of learning the hard way. So now you‟ve taken the short cut. That is basically
everything that we have for you in this show. We‟ll talk to you about in about 3 days from now. So I
want to close by reminding you. Change your strategy, meaning take the things that we teach you here
and implement them in your business. Change your strategy, change your business and in return it will
change your life. Have a great day.
Sandra: Have a great day.

How We Can Help You
We know that finding someone that you can trust online today is hard and that so many “so called
gurus” are self-‐appointed and have never really even done what they teach you to do. That‟s exactly
why we created the Double Your Profits Business Accelerator. This is an exclusive offer for our fans at
a fraction of its normal cost.
Here's what to expect. We'll Schedule a 'One on One' private session, where we'll take the time to dive
deep into your business and tell you what is missing, so that you can have your best year ever!
We'll do this by performing a S.W.O.T. Analysis. This tells us your Strengths, Weaknesses,
Opportunities and Threats within your business.
This will be an eye opener for YOU, for several reasons, however some of the most common reasons
are.
As the 'Business Owner' it‟s difficult to see the big picture of your own business because you‟re in the
middle of a daily management.
And you are too emotionally involved to completely impartial.
This is a common problem for EVERY business owner. It doesn‟t matter if you are a one-man army, or
an army of 150, the problem is still the same.
Travis Lane Jenkins
Business Mentor-Turn Around Specialist
Radio Host of The Entrepreneurs Radio Show
“Conversations with Self-made Millionaires and High-level Entrepreneurs That Grow Your Business"

The Entrepreneurs Radio Show 025 Jermaine Griggs

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